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Oct 6 12 1:36 PM

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I thought I would start this as a overall encompassing thread about things to look for when trying to establish if a Nagel is real or not.

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#1 [url]

Oct 6 12 1:57 PM

Up for sale on eBay currently, are some Nagel prints where the prints themselves seem real, but some of the signatures and numbering are not.

How can that be?  Well, sometimes folks would take an unsigned print, get out their pencil, and sing it in an attempt to sell it for more money than if it was unsigned.  Sometimes we've seen folks take a signed in screen print and take their pencil to it trying to pass it off as such.  Every once in awhile a print that should have been signed in the screen, does not get that screen printed signature.

There are also other cases where Nagel had some artist's proof or progressive sets in his cache that he never got around to signing before he died.  For example, I purchased from the estate Nagel's "Black and White Robe" unsigned artist's proof.  It has the Wasserman stamp and came directly from the estate, but Pat never signed it.  I know of several pieces like this, including a progressive set for "Just Looking" that is even in the book, that was found in Pat's stuff, still in the original folio Jeff Wasserman put it in for Pat.  *sigh*

I will say, in thirty years of collecting, I have only seen two or three prints pop up for sale where I suspected the prints themselves were a fake.  I think the fear-mongering about prevalence of fake prints has been extremely overstated.  More often is is that print was real, but the signature was faked.

Back to the prints that are currently for sale on eBay, please take a look at the images below for educational purposes and come to your own conclusions. :)

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#2 [url]

Oct 6 12 2:52 PM

wonder what ebay's policy is if someone bother's to file a complaint. probably in ebay's interest to do something about it.

interestingly, i imagine that a forged sig but legit serigraph has been devalued. saving the savy buyer money if the forger is willing to consummate the deal

been looking at heritage auctions history of nagel sales. as expected there is a pattern of lower sales prices for original works without signatures

wonder at what level a deceased artist's market value makes it worth some entity making a database of unsigned originals

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#3 [url]

Oct 6 12 3:13 PM

Re Heritage auction results, I don't think the existence of a signature has had any effect on the price of the originals.  Rather, I think the prices have been dictated by whether they were canvas or on board, how good the image is, and how recently the pieces have come up for auction. 

Personally, the Nagel's signature has negligible value when it comes to originals.


wonder what ebay's policy is if someone bother's to file a complaint. probably in ebay's interest to do something about it.
interestingly, i imagine that a forged sig but legit serigraph has been devalued. saving the savy buyer money if the forger is willing to consummate the deal
been looking at heritage auctions history of nagel sales. as expected there is a pattern of lower sales prices for original works without signatures
wonder at what level a deceased artist's market value makes it worth some entity making a database of unsigned originals

-waywardtom

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#4 [url]

Oct 7 12 1:14 AM

I concur in your analysis N-A, but DAMN!  That is a pretty good faked signature. 

I wish people would just leave their unsigned prints alone.  And their unsigned originals too.


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